kashif1976
Posts:3
Insaf Member
 | | 30/01/2012 5:03 PM |
| | I think PTI and jamat islami is very good alliace because both parties against currpution and many others issues you know. | | | |
|
saadkarim
Posts:919
Insaf Shaheen
| | 30/01/2012 10:30 PM |
| "Imran Khan indicated that talk with JI is on"
"Javed hashmi advice Imran to have talks with JI"
"Shafqat Mehmood deny as per decision of CEC"
However, the talks may be ON but the matter will be decide on next CEC meeting.
"The alliance with JI is not very very much desire but block the formation of MMA is much desire"
Those who oppose this alliance really believe that PTI will not be dented by MMA. Please comment on it on ground reality. | | | |
|
irfanrasool2013
Posts:12
Insaf Member
| | 31/01/2012 7:34 PM |
| | Some time around Karachi jalsa i got SMS from PTI.
The massage was something like this. should PTI get into electoral alliance with any other party yes or no and i replied yes.
The next massage was. which party should PTI make alliance with. The options were MQM,PMLN,APML,ANP.MMA.PPP,
That very moment i got confused. I was wondering why Jamaat e Islami is not mentioned in the LIST. still. good to see some progress on this front.
Pakhtunkhwa Milli Awami Party is another party with which allaince could be considered. | | | |
|
n_majid88
Posts:22
Insaf Activist
| | 01/02/2012 11:31 AM |
| nothing wrong with it
as jamaat is relatively a better party!!! | |
JAHAN-E-TAZA KI AFQAAR-E-TAZA SE HAI NAMOOD
K SUNG O KHISHT SE HOTE NAHI JAHAN PAIDA | |
|
Zohaibkhan
Posts:1060
Insaf Shaheen
| | 01/02/2012 1:02 PM |
| | PTI should not do an alliance but a seat adjustment. We will be in good bargaining position if we do constitunecy by contstituency seat adjustment rather than an alliance. In an alliance each party is treated equal where as in reality PTI is a much bigger force than JI. Seat adjustment with JI, Sunni Itthehad council will be beneficial for PTI. | | | |
|
saadkarim
Posts:919
Insaf Shaheen
| | 04/02/2012 2:19 AM |
| | I was listening Mujib ur Rehman Shami sahab yesterday, he is unbiased analyst infact soemtime favour PTI, was of opinion that if MMA created, it will be able to form government in KPK. | | | |
|
waqas
Posts:532
Insaf Shaheen
| | 04/02/2012 3:09 AM |
| | PTI should not do alliance with JI but can do seat adjustment in parts of KP, punjab and karachi. | | | |
|
fiazpk
Posts:466
Insaf Shaheen
| | 04/02/2012 5:14 AM |
| There should be seat adjustment or Alliance but not on 50-50 bases.
may be, 90-10 percent but JI is interested in 50-50. What to do ???
If there will be no cooperation between PTI and JI, and both are contesting alone, then both can suffer and specially JI.
But if JI will go to form MMA, with JUI and other religious parties then PTI will be suffering a lot. It is serious.
This issue is complicated.Lets see what happens. | |
======================================================
Look at your goals daily.Set and celebrate milestones.Do what you love and do it often.
====================================================== | |
|
MANZOORE
Posts:188
Insaf Shaheen
| | 04/02/2012 7:18 AM |
| ہم تو ڈوبے ہیں صنم
تم کو بھی لے ڈوبیں گے
Why Alliance with any one who were part of corrupts regimen in past especially with JI is very harmful for PTI .
1) They have bad name in universities and colleges due to voillance and authoritarian attitude .
2) They have good organization on street but not good name due to above reason .
3) Their party structure basically made up of familial and upper religious class . Their leadership is plagued with hegemonic class . They like other parties exploit their dedicated workers and consider them their subject in a way .
4) Their role in supporting dictatorship and creating Kalashnikov culture in Pakistan is not forgettable.
5) They have more similarities with JUI and other parties than PTI.
6) Youth support for PTI will prrhapse decline by authoritarian attitude of JI members .
7) we don't want any "insider " from PMLn , JUI and CIA in PTI
I believe no alliance before election but some sort of "term of engagement" or "understating "between JI and PTI will be beneficial for both .
| | | |
|
saadkarim
Posts:919
Insaf Shaheen
| | 04/02/2012 1:21 PM |
| @ Manzoore despite I dont want to reply but either you are too biased or informed, so I am replying your points in similar serial numbers.
1) I agree but perception of JI is better and mature in comparison to theri student wing.
2) Yes very good organziation.
3)Absolutely wrong. In Pakistan only MQM and JI are the two parties where people of middle class and lower middle class dominates.
4) JI may have supported dictator but never achieve personal gains from it. Every party has supported dictator in one form or other. Even PTI supported Musharraf in refrendum and many joined PTI who supported dictator.
5) JI is some party with some principles but JUI has no principle.
6) Youth does not only who is on social media, PTI may lose some youth but keep in mind the ground reality. Many youth who support conservative parties which may not reflect on social media.
7) I dont get your point. | | | |
|
MANZOORE
Posts:188
Insaf Shaheen
| | 04/02/2012 7:21 PM |
| @saadkarim
I am definitely not biased and not much informed but as much informed as any Pakistan of my age should be . I may be a Bagi too. I have been involved heavily with them as long as i lived in pakistan as college student and then as a young doctor. I have great respect for JI organization but my view has matured and changed over the course of time .�
My comments are personal humble assessment which I have drawn from my knowledge and experience .�
They have done great work in 2005 earthquake I have worked with them in Bagh during that time in a medical camp . They have dedicated and committed nuzriati workers with great organization .�
MQM superb organization ( and use of violence) evolved primarily from JI association of their founders members . MQM was created to counteract JI in Karachi in eighties .�
I agree JI and MQM have most people of middle class but I am talking about leadership in JI ( MQM is different in this regard). Leadership in all religious parties are hegemonic in political social and religious context . Could Javed Hashmi have been in a leadership position in JI if he had continued with them ?
JI principal have been dubious at times they opposed Pakistan movement , I don't know what they done in Bangladesh together with our army ,even today our bangali brothers turn their face away from pakistanis . ( I have been working with Bangladeshi colleagues since last 20 years as a medical professional ).�
All religious parties in alliance with , ISI and CIA created taliban (previously known as Mojahideen ) in Afghan jihad consequently they have done enormous damage to our culture society and mother land Pakistan . They have damaged our international image of a progressive peace loving , democratic nation to a terrorist nation . Pakistan troubled existence today stems from this enterprise of religious parties ,army and ....".foreign investors "
As Imran is a symbol of change , religiously reformed , confident ,transparent and openly talks about his dream of Pakistan as an Islamic welfare state I believe most of , PMLn , PPP and especially religiously inclined JI young workers have already embraced IK as a leader and joined PTI . IK is so confident about clean sweep that he has repeatedly mentioned that PTI can defeat even alliance of all parties . let's hope for the best otherwise we should wait and sit in opposition .
Lol
اچھا ہے دل کے ساتھ رہے پاسبان عقل
ليکن کبھي کبھي اسے تنہا بھي چھوڑ دے
. | | | |
|
saadkarim
Posts:919
Insaf Shaheen
| | 05/02/2012 6:01 AM |
| @Manzoore Replying to bring in your notice a matter of fact.
1. JI leadership comprises middle class people. Please correct your information.
2. JI was against the creation of Pakistan line ANP, JUI and many other but you cannot doubt on intention, JI beleieved that it was in favour of Muslims of India to remain united.
3. JI support united Pakistan in 1971 and still paying its price in Bangladesh. Sometimes we only read a point of view of one side, we only read what injustice Pak Army did but we ignore what mugti bahni did their.
4. Taliban has been created and promoted by the state of Pakistan in Benazir era. jamat-e-Islami has nothing to do with taliban. Infact, JI was supporter of Gulbadin Hikmatyar. JI supported the state policy of Jihad in Afghanistan and Kashmir but it was state policy.
I am afraid that you doesnt seems to be a student of history and unaware of Pakistan movement, the induction of feudals in Muslim League and steps taken by Quaid-e-Azam to win election of 1945, how religious slogan used to win the referendum of NWFP and sylhet. How the fatwa issued in favour of Muslim league just before election of 1945 and things changed, why Quaid start wearing Sherwani. I suggest you to just go through the phase of 1937 to 1947 of Pakistan movement and Quaid's strategies, learn politics from there, you will know what Imran is doing and why.
4. | | | |
|
huma2011
Posts:82
Insaf Tiger
| | 05/02/2012 7:41 AM |
| | In an ideal world would not want PTI to do alliance with any party. However in the present circumstances we want PTI to to win in the next election. Therefore they should take up every opportunity for maximum gain, providing its ethically & morally ok to do so. | | | |
|
MANZOORE
Posts:188
Insaf Shaheen
| | 06/02/2012 11:02 AM |
| @ saadkarim thanks for input
1).�
Please read my comments again carefully "I agree JI and MQM have most people of middle class but I am talking about leadership in JI ( MQM is different in this regard). Leadership in all religious parties are hegemonic in political social and religious context . Could Javed Hashmi have been in a leadership position in JI if he had continued with them ." �
where did I said leadership of JI does not belong to middle class . I am not referring to financial or ecnomic class I meant social religious and political class . . You can use dictionary to understand meaning of unfamiliar words (dictionary is never bias like history . )
2)�
Actions speaks louder than intention. One has not to be a history student to find out about JI role In supporting all marshal laws other that Ayub Khan.
Thank you for your advise to go through Pakistan history and to learn politics from there .
would you please elaborate which historian you recommend for this learning . A historian from Bangladesh , India , Pakistan or from British . �
�
Do I still need to go history classes even when living evidence are scattered around you , or one has witnessed part of history . JI supported marshal law of Yayah khan , Zia-ul- Haq and Musharaf .�
Do I need to take history lessons to believe that JI was a back bone of these unconstitutional rulers . Don't you feel JI and MMA along with our generals and corrupts politician are ultimately responsible for Pakistan suffering .
Collectively they are responsible for bloodshed of thosands of afghanis , Kashmiris , Bangladeshis and Pakistanis .�
Generations of poor afghan refuges displaced and rooted out from their villages , towns and cities and another generation born and grown up in camps and tents , just imagine if our families would have gone through this , even not a worst enemy would do this to any one .�
Afghan hate us more than any other nation , because we committed a kind of genocide on them in the name of jihad ( Same this happening in our tribal area and Baluchistan at present ) Was this genocide done deliberately or for some dollars . �
3)
You mentioned "JI support united Pakistan in 1971 and still paying its price in Bangladesh" �
�
My friend not only JI whole Pakistan is paying heavy price. I am afraid our future generation will be paying hefty price too . Just imagine if JI and MMA had not supported alcoholic general In 1971 than their could be a Bangladesh but no humiliation our nation suffered by surrendering 80000 strong troops to cowered hindus .
Our house today might not been burning if we had not set alight neighbor house in a war to benefit yahood and masara .
MMA alliance with Musharaf had resulted in unconditional support to NATO invasion of Afghanistan and slaughtering of thousands of afghans and Pakistanis . �
It goes on & on same rogue Mush burned innocent people in Lal Musjid . JI Did resign from their seat at that time but it was fruitless and for face saving .�
Monster Mush kept in power by JI ,JUI and corrupt politician and created NRO . PPP lead coalition of corrupts was imposed on Pakistan and rest is history in making .
4)
You are saying Benazir created Taliban I am not sure from which history book you have got this . Mullah Omer was a mujahideen fighter and grouped together with other mujahideen arranged by Zia,s remnants and ISI .They occupied and ruled Afghanistan from 1996 to 2001 .
. BB second term ended in 1996 by charges of corruption leveled against her led to the dismissal of her government by President Farooq Leghari . Was it Benazir who installed Taliban government in Afghanistan .??
Pakistan under PMLN , Saudi Arabia and UAE were only 3 countries who recognized Taliban government . �
You referred to the steps taken by Quid to win the election of 1945 .I believe he has not taken any help from JI or JUH because later one was bought out by Nehru .�
You mentioned. I quote " JI supported the state policy of Jihad in Afghanistan and Kashmir but it was state policy"
Very innocent . Supporting NATO invasion of afghan , selling hundred of pakistanis for dollars ,drone attacks , , Lal Musjid killing and notorious NRO were all state policies too . Where does JI stand to take some responsibilities for these 'state policies' .�
5)�
You feel that " JI was against the creation of Pakistan line ANP, JUI and many other but you cannot doubt on intention, JI beleieved that it was in favour of Muslims of India to remain united"
I feel JI and JUH made a wrong move by opposing Pakistan movement, supporting afghan jihad , and arm struggle in Kashmir , this all ended up in blood shed of muslim youths . This has polarized Muslim umma and divided us in groups rather than uniting . �
At the end I hop we will learn truth through some kind of wiki leaks not by history written by bias historian ... | | | |
|
Qadeer
Posts:571
Insaf Shaheen
| | 06/02/2012 11:53 AM |
| I want JI and PTI coming togather in next election but one thing we should remeber that JI is not as powerful as PTI now so negotiate them according to their status.  | |
President PS-125. Korangi, Karachi
www.facebook.com/PTILK
Pakistan Tehreek-e-Insaf Landhi-Korangi
------------------------------------------------- | |
|
fiazpk
Posts:466
Insaf Shaheen
| | 06/02/2012 2:01 PM |
| Qadeer
that is exactly what pti is explaining JI but JI is still reluctant in accepting PTI a bigger party than JI. | |
======================================================
Look at your goals daily.Set and celebrate milestones.Do what you love and do it often.
====================================================== | |
|